3D Stereo Camera Rigs and Sync

Stereo pictures general talk

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Re: 3D Stereo Camera Rigs and Sync

Postby BerndPietsch » Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:47 pm

Hello,
the problem is not the zoom which SM can handle very well. The problem are the little distortions due to the zoom. I could tell you a thing or two about it with my two action cams on the gimble. I had to select from 10 ones to find an acceptable pair that really is not perfect.
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Re: 3D Stereo Camera Rigs and Sync

Postby 526e012cdf7df37b6d000002 » Fri Jan 04, 2019 3:14 pm

Yes, i know, i wrote "With these cam lens correction cannot be disabled."
Thats my problem, because we cannot set 100% exactly the same zoom level on both cams.

Yes, i also know the actioncam route since hero1. Now i have 3 Firefly 8S-90 and 6 8S-170, so i can select a few pairs for 3D work :)
I use a modified Smooth Q gimbal for my 7cm rig.
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Re: 3D Stereo Camera Rigs and Sync

Postby 526e012cdf7df37b6d000002 » Sat Jan 05, 2019 9:12 am

RAW format doesnt have lens correction ;)
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Re: 3D Stereo Camera Rigs and Sync

Postby josebarbera » Thu Jun 27, 2019 1:25 pm

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Re: 3D Stereo Camera Rigs and Sync

Postby qant » Wed Sep 18, 2019 4:46 pm

This way with sony is very expensive... as i can see...

I suggest you to get VR180 head set as Oculus Go at least and use Insta vr180 3d camera, this is NEW way to get stereoscopic photos and videos imo, i am so glad i got this.

Because when you see those photos in VR headset the proportions its almos identical like in real life, and your brain think its real! Amazing feelings!

i hope people get this way to get real stuff soon =)

Come to see my photos and videos here: https://veer.tv/vr/antonbcn/uploads/all
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Re: 3D Stereo Camera Rigs and Sync

Postby josebarbera » Wed Jul 22, 2020 7:46 pm

Sony 3D Photography ... what's new about zoom sync, video sync, and extreme hyper stereo?


Today we have uploaded a video to YouTube on these issues: synchronization of the motorized zoom and the video sync (REC/STOP) in the current Sony cameras:

https://youtu.be/LxTxS8i88ME


Since spring 2018, a DSLRKIT female cable has been reported in Phereo, and also in Photo-3D group. It allows the perfect synchronization of all current Sony cameras, thanks to the existence of the Multi-Terminal port:

https://photo-3d.groups.io/g/main/topic/34930576#118953

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=296&start=10



On October 12, 2018, the Sony VMC-MM2 cable has been reported in Phereo, and also in Photo-3D group. It enables a miraculous, fully plug & play synchronization of all current Sony cameras

https://photo-3d.groups.io/g/main/topic/34930791#120124

https://www.sonyalpharumors.com/jose-ba ... lpha-rigs/

Video and zoom synchronization have been tried for a long time, with little success:



https://photo-3d.groups.io/g/main/topic/34931436#122451


Recently we have found two small devices that allow you to focus, shoot synchronously, and also synchronize zoom and video recording. Today we have uploaded this video to Youtube where you can see 3 devices working on 3 different Sony devices, with a wonderful synchronization of the motorized zoom:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxTxS8i88ME



On the other hand, the compact Sony cameras (travel cams), as the RX100 IV, can be a good choice:

https://www.fotocommunity.de/photo/3d-f ... n/42132755


Now the newest option, (with all the latest Sony technology: focus to the eyes, subject tracking, fast burst shooting etc) is the very recent Sony ZV-1, not only for vloggers :)

https://www.sony.com/electronics/cyber- ... meras/zv-1


But surely the most versatile (larger sensor and interchangeable lenses) are the mirrorless Sony cams:

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3979618


Synchronization only is possible following the two-step ritual (focus first and shoot later), and for this reason, the first attempts failed (according to some rumors), because without these ritual (shooting without previous focus) the synchronization is very bad: 4, 8 or more milliseconds.

Infrared devices failed because it doesn't allow that two-step ritual. Some people also tried that, in 2011, but also without success:

https://photo-3d.groups.io/g/main/topic/34906135#81549

On the other hand, the possibility of also synchronizing zoom and video has been discussed in various forums:

https://photo-3d.groups.io/g/main/messa ... 0,71595794

https://groups.io/g/ISU3D/topic/75522577#9


Three difficulties appear when we make 3D photography and 3D video using the current Sony Alpha cams.

1) The short length of Sony VMC-MM2
cable for make hyper stereo
2) Get video sync
3) Get zoom sync



Problem 1:

The limited length of the Sony VMC-MM2 cable only allows a cam separation about 60 cm and therefore we must look for other solutions to achieve greater camera separation when making 3D hyper stereo photography.

To capture distant and moving objects (with depth, this is in 3D), the hyper-stereo photographer must place the two cameras distant and parallel to each other (even several meters: “extreme hyper stereo photos”) in order to capture two sufficiently different perspectives, so that our brain, uniting the two photos perceive good depth, even when the objects are very far away: 200 meters, or even more.

For this reason, hyper stereo photography is a type of augmented reality, because it manages to obtain 3D stereo photos (also videos) of distant subjects showing depth between them, despite the fact that the human eye cannot see depth (only perspective, not stereopsis...) when the subjects are very far away.

Sometimes inexperienced eyes (their corresponding brain) interpret that augmented reality (surprising depth and roundness of distant objects) as authentic miniatures (that is the surprising “Lilliput -or miniature- effect”).


Problem 2:

On the other hand, achieving video synchronization using the VMC-MM2 cable is only possible in the latest camera models. Sony informs that is only possible if the firmware allows that the recording “start” can be assigned to the trigger button. From the manual “To synchronize video REC/STOP, the main camera must have "Movie with shutter" assigned to its release button, following these settings: Menu:-- > Movie 3: Movie with shutter button ON”

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/ww ... -MM2&cat=3

Perhaps video synchronization is possible in all other Sony models, through a future firmware update, but I think it could be convenient to find now a suitable solution.


Problem 3:

Getting a perfect Synchronization of the Sony motorized zooms also can be a very interesting matter in 3D video and also in 3D photo (in hyper and also in normo stereo) , but that is not possible using the Sony VMC-MM2 cable because it was designed to be used by Sony only for the RXO camera (so not for 3D photo) and this cam has a fixed lens (not interchangeable), without zoom.

Some colleagues, 3D lovers, have tried to synchronizing two paired Sony zooms using mechanical means, such as rubbers, tires, and straps, but with little success.


Researching to solve these 3 problems...

1) The short length of Sony VMC-MM2 cable for make hyper stereo
2) Video sync and
3) Zoom sync

... we can find interesting devices, now for sale in the market: wired and wireless devices:



A.- Wired devices

A1:- Cable extenders for the Multi-Terminal port to increase the distance between both cameras making hyper stereo photography.
A2: - Useful wired devices to synchronize the zoom of both cameras:

.- Sony Stativ VCT-SGR1
.- Sony GPVPT1.CE7(Minitrypod)
.- Sony RM-VPR1 (Minitrypod)
and several clones...

B.- Wireless devices

B1.- Pixel RW-221/S2 controller:
B2.- Pixel TW-283/S2 remote controller
B3.- Pholsy Wireless Remote with an intervalometer.
B4.- JJC 2.4G 100M Wireless Remote Control for Sony
B5.- LanParte Wireless Remote Control for Sony.



Here is a short post with an overview of them:


A.- Wired devices

A1:- Trying to increase the distance between both cameras making hyper stereo photography

As previously mentioned, some brands (DSLRKIT and others ) manufacture cables (female and male) that, joined, can synchronize two Sony cameras, in a similar way to how the Sony cable works: Plug & Play. Using these 2 cables both cameras can be master and also slave, interchangeably.

Between these 2 cables (female and male) can be connected an extender cable (2, 3, 5M long or more) with 2.5 mm plugs:

Female and male cables:
https://savemoney.es/asin/B00M6N0FQ8
https://savemoney.es/asin/B00KWXK6CC

Cable extender:
https://www.ebay.es/itm/5m-Stereo-2-5mm ... 2749.l2649

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Small-Mini-2-5 ... oZ1Ro8mYmw

That allows hyper stereo photos taken with a long distance between both cameras ( in order to capture two sufficiently different perspectives, so that brain can perceive depth between objects very far away)) but that not allows video rec sync and zoom synchronization.

A2: - Useful wired devices to synchronize the zoom of both cameras (or more, for lenticular pics)

They are also very useful to shoot hyper stereo photos or videos, allowing an increase in the distance between the cams.

Several inside cables allow controlling focus, shooting, and also zoom from external control, keeping the camera without any vibration on a tripod.

They can be very useful in 2D video recording, but they are very difficult to use for 3D stereo photography (because then both paired cameras must have the same focal length at all times..) or 3D stereo video (then, in addition, we need to synchronize the start and the stop recording).

Sony and several brands have marketed various wired devices to remotely control the motorized zoom of the Alpha cameras (zoom, in addition to focusing, shot, on and off). There are various prices, in accordance with its sophistication, even with tripod function, as Sony RM-VPR1, VCT-SGR1, Sony GPVPT1.CE7 and several clones.

The simplest Sony cable (RM-VPR1, 60€, no tripod), has several clones: Pholsy, Fotga, Mcplus, JJC SR-F2, and two brands (Topiky and Fotga) make a similar cable, but with a longer length:

https://savemoney.es/asin/B07Y9R48LH
https://savemoney.es/asin/B07VZZL1Q9

Sony Stativ VCT-SGR1 : Minitrypod: https://savemoney.es/asin/Sony%20Stativ%20VCT-SGR1
Sony GPVPT1.CE7 - Minitrypod : 100 euros : https://savemoney.es/asin/Sony%20GPVPT1.CE7

The obsolete RMT-VP1K (and other infrared devices) is not suitable for stereo photography since a good and perfect synchronization always requires two steps: focus (first) and shoot (later), but that is not possible using any infrared shooting device:

https://www.sony.es/electronics/tripode ... s/rmt-vp1k

https://savemoney.es/asin/B074SCK3HS
https://savemoney.es/asin/RMTDSLR2.CE

The Sony GP-VPT2BT Bluetooth device is also not suitable for 3D photos due to an identical reason: the absence of the two ritual steps: focus (first) and shooting (later):
https://savemoney.es/asin/Sony%20GP-VPT2BT

In addition, SmallRig sells a wooden handgrip with a remote trigger for Sony cams, also with remote video start/stop.
http://www.smallrig.com/smallrig-right- ... r2511.html

We have used two (one is Sony, the other is Fotga). The zoom works perfectly on the motorized lens, and “on, off, focus, shot” also works fine. All that is very useful in flat 2D photo, always without any vibration.

Perhaps it will be possible, in order to shoot 3D photos, synchronized video, and zoom sync to obtain a Y branch from one device, with two plugs in order to connect 2 twinned cams. But I have found, inside 8 cables. I think soldering those 8 very slim wires is a very difficult job.



B.- Wireless devices

There are several devices that allow, wirelessly, to shoot both cameras simultaneously with very good synchronization with a disparity between both cams of less than half a millisecond.

Of course, just like when we are using cables, synchronization only works by doing the well-known two-step ritual: first focus (half-press) then shooting (full pressing). For this reason, devices that work by infrared (the obsolete RMT-VP1K and others) or Bluetooth (Sony GP-VPT2BT and RMTP1BT.SYU) are not useful.

But the wireless devices using 2.4GHz can be very useful in hyper stereo photography (3D photography of very distant subjects) because then both cameras can be fired synchronously with great separation between them, shooting to fireworks, landscapes, distant fauna, etc. The distance between the shutter and the cameras can be 60, 80, or 100 meters and for that reason, the two cameras can be 120, 160, or 200 meters apart from each other, with the shutter in the middle.

Using the wireless devices it is very easy to make extreme hyper stereo and also, in addition, some models can solve the already commented problems two and three: video sync and also zoom sync. We are going to see 5 different devices of this type.

B1.- Pixel RW-221/S2 controller

Without an LCD display. It allows us to trigger the camera wirelessly up to 100 meters. It is the simplest model (allowing only on, off, focus and shoot), without zoom sync and without video sync, but very useful in hyper stereo photography.

Four modes of shooting: single shooting, high-speed continuous shooting, BULB, and 4s delay shooting.

One transmitter is able to fire multiple receivers at the same time (that also can be very useful when taking lenticular photography): via the well-known two-step ritual (half-press to autofocus the camera and full press to shoot).

https://savemoney.es/asin/Pixel%20RW-221/S2
https://savemoney.es/asin/B01CJ5UBG6


B2.- Pixel TW-283 / S2 controller

With an LCD display. It works wirelessly up to 80 meters.

FSK 2.4 GHz Wireless Control System: It features no directionality and ultra-powerful anti-interference ability. With 30 channels for options, it can avoid interference caused by other similar devices.

4 modes for shutter release control: simple single shooting, BULB shooting, delay shooting, and timer schedule shooting.

6 setting for timing control: delay timer, long exposure time, interval time, number of shoots, repeat shooting interval time and repeat times.

Despite the 6 settings for time control, it doesn't have a significant advantage for taking s3D photos and is more expensive than the previous model (Pixel RW-221 / S2).

https://savemoney.es/asin/B017GY5KWA
https://savemoney.es/asin/B017GY5KWA


B3.- Pholsy Wireless controller (with an intervalometer)

With an LCD display. It allows us to trigger the camera wirelessly up to 60 meters.

4 types shutter: S (single shooting), C (continuous shooting), B (Bulb), 2S (2 seconds delay) and 5 timer functions: Delay timer, interval, long exposure time, N (number of frames setting). Also with BKLN (Auto bracketing for HDR, shutter release with instant, continuous 3, 5 or 7 shots).

None of these 3 models (B1, B2, B3) can synchronize video recording or allow synchronizing the zoom of Sony cameras.

https://savemoney.es/asin/B01NCYY1LW


B4.-JJC 2.4G 100M Sony Wireless Controler

Without an LCD display. Works at a frequency of 2.4GHz. That allows the transmitter to trigger the receiver from 100 meters away, therefore it is possible almost 200 meters of separation between both cameras.

One transmitter is able to fire multiple receivers at the same time. That can be very useful when taking lenticular 3D photography.

Features multi-functions - power on / off, video start / stop, focusing / shooting, zooming and also ... displaying grid lines.

Transmitter (and also the paired receivers, placed in the flash slot) needs a standard battery.

https://savemoney.es/asin/B078ZC8DYD



B5.- LanParte Wireless Remote Control for Sony.

Without an LCD display.

2.4Ghz wireless control with 30 meters range. That implies that both cameras can be located almost 60 meters apart.

It controls multiple receivers and cameras to sync shooting, sync zoom (when power zoom lens is used), and also sync video as well (start/stop).

It is very useful in hyper stereo photography (60 meters is the maxim stereo base), and, in addition, it can controlling sync zoom and video (start/stop).

Only the transmitter needs a standard battery, but the very small paired receivers (placed in the multiterminal ports) don’t need a battery.

https://savemoney.es/asin/B07986K6ZF

These two last extraordinary devices for the Sony cams (JJC 2.4G and LanParte Wireless Remote) allow us to shoot wirelessly (with a miraculously synchronized zoom and video) using two or more perfectly synchronized cameras (separated since few centimeters until 200 meters in order to shoot 3D hyper stereo pics).

For these reasons they are a perfect complement of the Sony VMC-MM2 cable, already discussed here a few months ago:

https://www.sonyalpharumors.com/jose-ba ... lpha-rigs/

The LanParte Wireless device (it has very small battery-free receivers), allows a separation between the paired cams of almost 120 meters. That distance is usually enough in 3D hyper stereo photography.

If we even need more separation (up to 200 meters), we can use the JJC 2.4G 100M Wireless Controller. It is a bigger and heavier device because it also has batteries in their receivers.




LanParte Wireless vs JJC 2.4G 100M Controller

The LanParte Wireless device (it has very small battery-free receivers)
allows a separation between the paired cams of almost 120 meters.
That distance is usually enough in 3D hyper stereo photography.

If we need even more separation (up to 200 meters), we can use
the JJC 2.4G 100M Wireless Controller, but it is bigger and
heavier device because it also has batteries in their receivers,
not only in the transmitter as the Lanparte.

You can use one of these two last devices (JJC wireless Control and LanParte Wireless) to solve
all three big problems in Sony 3D photography, exposed at the beginning of this article:

1) The short length of Sony VMC-MM2 cable for make hyper stereo
2) Video sync and
3) Zoom sync


Therefore, these devices can greatly increase the versatility of Sony cameras when we make 3D photography or 3D video.


We now have 3D equipment of quality and versatility identical to that of 2D flat photography professionals!


Good luck with Sony's new era of 3D photography !!


Enjoy all those possibilities !!!

If you have any questions, please, let me know.

Best regards

José Barberà Martí
elxjob@yahoo.es

http://phereo.com/josebarbera
https://stereopix.net/jose_barbera
https://holopix.page.link/S7K9


PS
Please watch the explanatory video here: https://youtu.be/LxTxS8i88ME
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Re: 3D Stereo Camera Rigs and Sync

Postby josebarbera » Wed Jul 22, 2020 8:02 pm

Here are 3 anaglyphs from 3 wireless devices.

The last two are capable of synchronizing (in addition to focus and shooting) the zoom and the video (REC/STOP)

1.JPG
Pixel RW-221/S2 & Sony A6300
Attachments
3.JPG
Lanparte Wireless Control & Sony A5100
2.JPG
JJC 2.G Sony Remote Control
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